Types of Jujitsu

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Types of Jujitsu

Postby Slartibartfast » Mon Feb 11, 2008 5:01 pm | #1

I apologise in advance if I am asking a question that has already been laboured over time and time again, however I am a newbie and it is a newbies job, nay DUTY to make these mistakes. How else will I learn?

I study Jujitsu under the WJJF syllabus and love it. Seriously love it. I go three times a week and would go more often were it more convenient for me to do so. I recently achieved my green belt (I hear a lot of people snidely commenting that no-one fails a WJJF grading. I assure you, you come of the tatami KNOWING that you earned your belt. Maybe the sensei just doesn't put you in if you are not ready. It's expensive enough without having to pay for a re-grade.)

I hear about all these different forms of Jujitsu and was wondering where WJJF jujitsu fell. The books and senseis all say that it doesn't fall under a particular form, in fact it tries to avoid this entirely by being an holistic art which is just jujitsu in and of itself.

Does anyone have an opinion/explanation that contrasts with this?

Any other WJJF people out there have any contribution?
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Postby ToffeeApple » Mon Feb 11, 2008 6:03 pm | #2

Ask onedragons. Most of us are from a rather different background and the only personal experience I've had with an advanced student of wjjf was terrible.
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Postby Slartibartfast » Mon Feb 11, 2008 9:57 pm | #3

Well I'm glad to say that my experiences have been positive. I am not naive enough to think that every WJJF practitioner is a saint, I am sure that here are plenty of less than pleasant people as I am sure there are in every art.
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Postby dark_recess » Mon Feb 11, 2008 10:59 pm | #4

what sorta cost is membership and/or grading in wjjf?
and what sorta things do you do in it, where is the focus in training centred?
[i have no experience whatsoever with wjjf]

also, what order are the belts in?
you said your a newbie, but your a green? did you mean new to the website...
in tjf which i have trained you must pass 3 gradings to get green...
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Postby Slartibartfast » Mon Feb 11, 2008 11:15 pm | #5

Well its £4 for an hour long class, £5 for 1 1/2 hours. I think the first year of insurance was £30 and £25 a year after that. Gi was £35 and a grading is £15. Each of the badges (one per grading) is a fiver, so yeah not cheap!

I'm a newbie to the site, been practicing/studying JJ for about a year and seven months now. Green is the Fourth belt we grade to. the order is as follows.

Red (ungraded), white, yellow, orange, green, blue, purple, brown, 1st dan etc. The first few belts you normally would be ready for after 3 months, the later belts take longer to get ready for, with one year between brown and 1st dan.

The syllabus is really quite good. http://www.jujitsuireland.com/syllabus.asp It concentrates on throws and locks, as per, but we also get a lot of sparring and grapple work done.
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Postby Genghis » Tue Feb 12, 2008 9:23 am | #6

Slartibartfast wrote:Well its £4 for an hour long class, £5 for 1 1/2 hours. I think the first year of insurance was £30 and £25 a year after that. Gi was £35 and a grading is £15. Each of the badges (one per grading) is a fiver, so yeah not cheap!

I'm a newbie to the site, been practicing/studying JJ for about a year and seven months now. Green is the Fourth belt we grade to. the order is as follows.

Red (ungraded), white, yellow, orange, green, blue, purple, brown, 1st dan etc. The first few belts you normally would be ready for after 3 months, the later belts take longer to get ready for, with one year between brown and 1st dan.

The syllabus is really quite good. http://www.jujitsuireland.com/syllabus.asp It concentrates on throws and locks, as per, but we also get a lot of sparring and grapple work done.


All sounds pretty conventional to me, although maybe a bit faster than most of us are used to up through the junior belts.

I'm pretty certain (this was 1988!) that my first club was WJJF, can't say that my recollections do it any disservice particularly.

Clearly junior grades in most styles have much to learn, and every club needs money to keep going - those fees are pretty much on a par with most non-profit clubs I've ever trained with.

G
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Postby Slartibartfast » Tue Feb 12, 2008 10:18 am | #7

All sounds pretty conventional to me, although maybe a bit faster than most of us are used to up through the junior belts.

I did mean 3 months per belt, not three months all in!
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Postby Genghis » Tue Feb 12, 2008 10:49 am | #8

Yes, I guessed that.

That said, if you're training 3 times per week, it's probably about right.  My experience of students training 1-2 times per week is perhaps 6-8 months per belt over the junior belts.

G
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Postby OneDragons » Tue Feb 12, 2008 7:01 pm | #9

Not entirely sure what your questions are, you seem to have a general feel of wanting to know what other styles of JuJitsu are like, but Im not too sure what else you want to know.

Most styles of Ju Jitsu Ive come across either have strong similarities with WJJF or TJF as the two are quite different. Most other UK styles seem to be derived from one of these two lineages.
Since WJJF is older it has had more influence across a greater number of different 'groups/associations' in the UK.
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Postby Bulk » Wed Feb 13, 2008 10:42 am | #10

without an extended essay can you elaborate a little on the differences?
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Postby jitsukerr » Wed Feb 13, 2008 11:06 am | #11

What about Jikishin?  Where does that fit in?
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Postby pressurepoint » Wed Feb 13, 2008 11:32 am | #12

This is my belief

Jikishin was headed up by Terry Parker
Terry Parker was part of WJJF
Terry Parker was also an early member of BJJA

The Jikishin syllabus is similar to WJJF syllabus

Both Terry Parker (Jikishin) and Robert Clark (WJJF) were taught at some time by Alan Bundell

All of this may or may not be true but if it is it links a whole lot of Jujitsu in the UK together.
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Postby Gra » Wed Feb 13, 2008 11:46 am | #13

Jujutsu is originally a Japanese martial art, and in Japan there is a great deal of variety, with tecniques and practices in different schools not looking much like each other.

The transmission to the West has been quite limited, the first few teachers to arrive from Japan taught only parts of their syllabuses. Then Judo arrived and tended to dominate things. People in the UK and other non-Asian countries started to develop their own styles, drawing mainliy from judo, karate and aikido.

So 99% of jujutsu in the UK is now of this type, and tends to be quite similar. Kempo jiujutsu stands out as being a a little different, but I'd say  thats more down to their emphasis on incorporating bits of Chinese and Japanese striking arts. You will get roughly the same tecniques in WJJF or TJF, who are particularly influenced by judo.

Consequently there is a significant difference between Japanese jujutsu and the generic jiu-jitsu that you are likely to encounter in the UK. That doesn't mean the UK stuff is in any way inefective, it may well be better as self defence than much of the true Japanese jujutsu, it just has different origins.

Personally, I don't really like WJJF, but it's probably decent enough.

Jikishin was a splinter from the Robert Clarke/WJJF line I believe.
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Postby Slartibartfast » Wed Feb 13, 2008 12:10 pm | #14

Gra wrote:You will get roughly the same techniques in WJJF or TJF, who are particularly influenced by judo.

Personally, I don't really like WJJF, but it's probably decent enough.

Jikishin was a splinter from the Robert Clarke/WJJF line I believe.


Is Judo not derived from Jujitsu? I thought it was teh sport form.

What do you not like about WJJF?
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Postby Urban Fisherman » Wed Feb 13, 2008 12:19 pm | #15

Bulk wrote:without an extended essay can you elaborate a little on the differences?


Trying not to be too controversial; WJJF descended ju jitsu feels as if it has had a lot more karate influencing it, there's more emphasis on proper stances and on karate like striking; the throws are workman-like, and are often expected to flow from punches or kicks. TJF has an emphasis on aesthetically pleasing throws, frequently without strikes being necessary, and has impressive breakfalling to survive the throws; the attacks are largely unschooled, and supposed to simulate "street attacks", (although this is highly controversial). Of course, within both styles there are better instructors and worse instructors.
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